General Discussions
This is the place to discuss general issues related to the U-boat war or the war at sea in WWII.
RE: German U-boat Designs and Japanese Subs
Posted by:
Rich Mickle
()
Date: May 20, 2001 12:06AM
<HTML>
Frank,
The Germans, at least, did share information on submarines. They even sold at least one boat to the Japanese which sailed to Singapore and then on to Japan. I\'m drawing a blank right now on the designation and type, but it was obviously one of the long range boats, I imagine a Type IXD2 or IXC or maybe even VIIF. I could be wrong here. There may have been a few more sold during the conflict as well. I\'m sure some of the other folks on the site can be more specific on this. I do know the Japanese were anxious to get their hands on a German boat as theirs were mechanically inferior compared to the Germans.
When Germany surrendered, the Japanese did seize four U-boats still in Japanese ports. Three of them were Type IXD2 and the other an XB minelayer which had been converted for cargo carrying. They were given Japanese designations I-501, I-502, I-505, and I-506. I do not believe they saw any action other than perhaps being in port when the port was attacked by Allied aircraft.
As far as submarine related information, I know the Germans were far from pleased with Japanese doctrine and attempted to point this out to their allies. The Japanese preferred to use subs as part of battle fleets, flung out ahead of their fleets as screens to detect and perhaps engage enemy fleets. This is actually doctrine that several navies adopted to a degree between the wars, including the US. When it became apparent that the battles they had envisioned were not going to occur, the Japanese used their subs in a defensive posture, setting up static lines of subs to detect advancing Allied fleets around their territories. They also used them as cargo carriers for isolated islands that could not be safely reached by regular transports and naval vessels. This left relatively few submarines available for offensive actions the Germans and Italians were much more successful at. The Japanese placed little emphasis on attacking enemy merchant vessels and thus sank relatively few compared to their Axis partners. This was most disapointing to the Germans who had little affect on changing Japan\'s doctrine in this regard. More is the pity for the Germans since the Japanese had a rather large submarine fleet that may have had a much more devastating affect had it been concentrated on Allied shipping in the manner of the Germans and Italians. I don\'t know though, inspite of the size of this fleet, the boats were mechanically inferior to U-boats and crews not nearly as well trained.
There was some technology transfer here and there. I know the Japanese eventually worked on snorkels, samples of which they had obtained from the Germans. I do not know if any of their boats used them however.
As far as submarine related information being transferred to the Germans from the Japanese that was at all useful, I do not know about and doubt such happened. This is actually an interesting question. Aside from perhaps operational assistance on operating in the Indian Ocean (?), I can\'t even guess at anything. The technology at least was probably one way from Germany to Japan with regard to submarines. Perhaps someone could correct me on this??
I believe the Japanese still have the most successful submarine launched torpedo salvo ever. A Japanese sub attacked a US task force with six torpedos, three of which sank the US carrier WASP, another sank an accompanying destroyer, and a fifth struck a battleship some distance away.
If you want to read more on Japanese subs, there is a book available probably through this site by Carl Boyd and a Japanese historian whose name I have forgotten you might try looking up--this site probably lists it.
Hope this helps some.
Regards,
Rich</HTML>
Frank,
The Germans, at least, did share information on submarines. They even sold at least one boat to the Japanese which sailed to Singapore and then on to Japan. I\'m drawing a blank right now on the designation and type, but it was obviously one of the long range boats, I imagine a Type IXD2 or IXC or maybe even VIIF. I could be wrong here. There may have been a few more sold during the conflict as well. I\'m sure some of the other folks on the site can be more specific on this. I do know the Japanese were anxious to get their hands on a German boat as theirs were mechanically inferior compared to the Germans.
When Germany surrendered, the Japanese did seize four U-boats still in Japanese ports. Three of them were Type IXD2 and the other an XB minelayer which had been converted for cargo carrying. They were given Japanese designations I-501, I-502, I-505, and I-506. I do not believe they saw any action other than perhaps being in port when the port was attacked by Allied aircraft.
As far as submarine related information, I know the Germans were far from pleased with Japanese doctrine and attempted to point this out to their allies. The Japanese preferred to use subs as part of battle fleets, flung out ahead of their fleets as screens to detect and perhaps engage enemy fleets. This is actually doctrine that several navies adopted to a degree between the wars, including the US. When it became apparent that the battles they had envisioned were not going to occur, the Japanese used their subs in a defensive posture, setting up static lines of subs to detect advancing Allied fleets around their territories. They also used them as cargo carriers for isolated islands that could not be safely reached by regular transports and naval vessels. This left relatively few submarines available for offensive actions the Germans and Italians were much more successful at. The Japanese placed little emphasis on attacking enemy merchant vessels and thus sank relatively few compared to their Axis partners. This was most disapointing to the Germans who had little affect on changing Japan\'s doctrine in this regard. More is the pity for the Germans since the Japanese had a rather large submarine fleet that may have had a much more devastating affect had it been concentrated on Allied shipping in the manner of the Germans and Italians. I don\'t know though, inspite of the size of this fleet, the boats were mechanically inferior to U-boats and crews not nearly as well trained.
There was some technology transfer here and there. I know the Japanese eventually worked on snorkels, samples of which they had obtained from the Germans. I do not know if any of their boats used them however.
As far as submarine related information being transferred to the Germans from the Japanese that was at all useful, I do not know about and doubt such happened. This is actually an interesting question. Aside from perhaps operational assistance on operating in the Indian Ocean (?), I can\'t even guess at anything. The technology at least was probably one way from Germany to Japan with regard to submarines. Perhaps someone could correct me on this??
I believe the Japanese still have the most successful submarine launched torpedo salvo ever. A Japanese sub attacked a US task force with six torpedos, three of which sank the US carrier WASP, another sank an accompanying destroyer, and a fifth struck a battleship some distance away.
If you want to read more on Japanese subs, there is a book available probably through this site by Carl Boyd and a Japanese historian whose name I have forgotten you might try looking up--this site probably lists it.
Hope this helps some.
Regards,
Rich</HTML>
| Subject | Written By | Posted |
|---|---|---|
German U-boat Designs and Japanese Subs
|
Frank Blazich | 05/19/2001 07:33PM |
|
RE: German U-boat Designs and Japanese Subs
|
Rich Mickle | 05/20/2001 12:06AM |
|
RE: German U-boat Designs and Japanese Subs
|
Yuri IL\'IN | 05/20/2001 08:38PM |
|
RE: German U-boat Designs and Japanese Subs
|
yorktr | 05/20/2001 11:13PM |
|
RE: German U-boat Designs and Japanese Subs
|
Rich Mickle | 05/26/2001 10:49AM |
|
RE: German U-boat Designs and Japanese Subs
|
kurt | 05/21/2001 02:52AM |